I recently was looking for a used Les Paul. I saw a Les Paul Supreme on Craig’s List for only $750! – They normally retail at $3,400+.
I had high hopes that this was a seller who just wasn’t aware of what he/she had and I would score. Luckily, the seller was honest and emailed me back with info stating that it was NOT a USA made Gibson and it was a replica.
I was surprised, since the photos showed “Gibson” on the headstock and even the truss rod cover, fret inlays, and the supreme headstock detail logo was all in place. These were low quality photos, so you couldn’t see all of the details clearly.
I was baffled and upset that there was a company making replicas that actually say GIBSON on them. I understand that Epiphone is Gibson’s sister company that does make their products overseas for a lower price, but they clearly say Epiphone, not Gibson.
I did some research and found this posts which sells several replicas. There are pics, and I would say, from the images, these replicas are pretty dead on and look nice. Neck thru body construction, and they even have what appears to be Grover tuning knobs.
http://www.ioffer.com/bi/guitarworld688–GIBSON-LES-PAUL-SUPREME-CONDITION-W-GIBSON-CASE–67394871
That site also has fake Ibanez Jem 7’s, and a few other models. Although the site does not promote the products as real Gibsons, and Ibanez’es, they do not make a huge attempt to indicate they are NOT real. An experienced guitarists or buyer, would realize that the low prices ($180 – $250) are sign that something is wrong. But, there are those younger and less experienced who may be fooled. The other issue are those who are purchasing with intent put them back on the market as a true Gibson! I am choosing NOT to support this market, and I hope others make that choice too. It only leads to a contaminated market and makes buyers, and collectors weary about buying one of the best guitars ever made.
I was really pissed when I saw an image that they imprint a serial number and “Made in the U.S.A.” on the back of the headstock! You can even see that they package it inside a Gibson branded cardboard box, almost identical to the actual ones. This is more than a replica, it is a premeditated counterfeit!
I understand if a company wants to replicate one of the best guitars out there as many have, but don’t try to make a counterfeit.
I found a nice post about this on eBay from a fellow guitarist who is also concerned about this. Here are his tips, although, you can see from the photos, that some will be hard to tell, as the truss rod cover in these images do only have 2 screws and the logo looks very convincing. Down to the angle and placement.
1. The guitar is located in China or some other Asian country. No Gibsons are manufactured in China, all Gibsons are US Made. Gibson has satellite companies like Epiphone that manufacture overseas and are much less expensive.
2. The sellers sometimes state that the country of origin is China, apparently in a half hearted attempt to dispell that the guitars are real, even though they stamp Made in USA right on the guitars.
3. There are some subtle differences between the fake Les Pauls and the real thing. Look closely at the headstock front. Most of the fakes have a Gibson logo that is of a thicker font than the real Gibson logo and is aligned almost horizontally at the top of the headstock. The real Gibson logo is a thinner font and is angled with the G started near the post of the D string tuner. The real key is to look at the truss rod cover. Real Gibsons have a bell shaped truss rod cover with TWO screws. Every fake I’ve seen has a cover with a similiar shape but with THREE screws. Also, the copies of Les Paul Standards often say “Gibson” right on the truss rod cover, NO Les Pauls say Gibson on the truss rod cover, some Epiphone Les Pauls do but those aren’t made in the USA and say Epiphone at the top of the headstock not Gibson.
4. These guitars that are often stamped with legitimate looking serial numbers but they don’t always match the true manufacture years of the real Gibson guitars.
5. All high end Les Pauls come with nice Gibson cases, these fakes rarely include a case.
6. ASK THE SELLER – many of them will admit that the guitars are made in China, and remember, no Gibsons, especially those that say Made in USA, are made in China.
Click here to view his original review/post
Gibson Counterfeit Site
Here is another post about the fakes and unfortunately, tells the sad story of a 15 year old who was scammed with a fake Les Paul.
http://www.gibson.com/en-us/Lifestyle/Features/CounterfeitGibsons/
Check your serial number
You can visit this site and enter in the serial number for a validation check. The only thing is, this will only tell you when and which Gibson factory it was manufactured at, it will not tell you the model.
http://www.guitardaterproject.org/gibson.aspx
It is possible that a fake could be using a true serial, so please be aware of that when making a Gibson purchase.
Just beware when buying one. Know your seller or retailer and make sure to double check every little detail!
Hi I agree with all of your concerns as a luthier and owner of Colorado Guitar Company- this is absurd and will lead to someone ( perhaps many) losing their money- However people have been making on-offs for a long time and puitting Gibson or Fenfder on the headstock- p.s they are set neck not throught the body
Thanks for your feedback on this. I do want to clarify that just because this post is recent, it doesn’t mean that this is a new concept. As Ron mentioned, it has been occurring for quite some time now. It is sad and unfortunate, but in any industry when there is a great product made, there will be knock-offs and counterfeits. It just shows how great the originals really are.
Even with the fakes that have set-necks, I have seen knock-offs that do have neck-through body construction as well, which means that it is getting really difficult to distinguish the real from the fake.
Let’s hope that innocent musicians don’t get robbed by these!
Hey guys,
I purchased one of these copied Supremes from Ebay with full knowledge that it was an imitation, but for the price I was very curious. After receiving the item, I was absolutely astounded at the build quality. These do have genuine Grover machine heads but lack the Gibson truss rod cover and fret inlays. They are a great buy for anyone looking for a good looking guitar at a bargain price, and after getting it set up by a recognised Luthier, playind like the real thing. I would have to say however that I would never consider selling this as the ganuine article. The price range for these should be below the price of a comparable Epiphone. Anyone who sells these as the original article should be reported, especially if they do so with the knowledge that it is a rip off.
my girlfriend bought me one of the chinese replicas second hand for a xmas prezzie for £250(zakk wylde bullseye)thinking it was an epi bullseye. anyway when i first saw it i was delighted thinking i had the epi. then i looked at the headstock and saw the gibson logo. i thought it was real cos it looked and felt so good and thought the seller mustn’t have known. anyway shortly thereafter i thought “i ain’t this lucky” so i had a look at the wiring and got suspicious, well not suspicious, i knew it wasn’t real cos the wiring was a mess. all other detail was spot on though. except the serial number that apparently has zw at the start on the real one and this doesn’t. plugged it in and to be honest thought it sounded pretty good with the supposed EMGs it had.. didn’t feel the tone and vol pots where that true though. the heads said grover but it didn’t stay in tune either. all in all though it wasn’t bad. i decided to make it a project so i have fitted seymour duncan PAFs sh-1 blues set and put on chrome rather than gold schaller heads and a chrome gotoh bridge and tailpiece raher than the gold. the guy in the shop said this would give better sustain. having done that the sound is much better and is a pretty vintage tone with the SDs. thought i would got the whole way and left it in the shop to get a complete rewire and have all the pots changed for good quality ones. i haven’t had it back from the shop but reckon it will be a pretty hot instrument. it looks shit hot and cos i have changed the look of it i ain’t pretending it’s not a replica. gonna keep it anyway. all in all it has cost £235 to pimp it. i think my girl paid too much for it, but that was her money so “hey!”. think i have a pretty dandy guitar for £485 about the same as a bullseye epi with better pups for the stuff i play (blues) and decent hardware. will let you know what it’s like when i get it out of the shop. wish me luck… would still rather it had been the epi, could have saved me a load of bother!
If they sell it for low prices as 200 300 bucks we wont hesitate over a choise and decide its fake,but what if they start selling their counterfeit guitars for normal Gibson prices? then how can we spot them?
I have a blog which may help.
great site for helping with spotting fakes!
i was looking around for ways and sites to see if i have a knockoff the guitar for 750 on CL i have contacted gibson and sent many many photos ….email me if theres a site against Gibson knockoffs I will support 100%
I heard about this site that sold these replica les pauls. When I clicked to the site I was floored with the look of the head stocks serial#’s, “made in the u.s.a” stamped on the back of the head stock like the real deal and selling for $165.00 yes you heard right ,I SAID 165.00 American bucks. Times are a little tuff to fork out big bucks for a real custom black beauty ($3,500-4,500). I have 41 guitars 5 are real Gibson les pauls. So for $305. delivered to my doorstep I figure I take a chance. Now all but 4 of My guitars are Made in the good ole’ U.S of A. Took 6 days a get here. When I opened the foam case it came in I was floored with the look of this guitar. Suttle differences but it was of high qaulity, that was for sure!! Epi pick-ups, cheap bridge , I think knock-off grovers, the gibson logo and custom logo on the head stock where not raised above the clearcoat like the real gibsons are. The vol. knob for the rhythm pick up is slighly off just a very little bit. I replaced the pickups and sanded the frets down a little to my liking. Looks great and sounds good with some little modifications.Can’t beat it for the money even If I replace all the hardware it’s still deal. Too much of a risk though, I heard I lot of bad ones are out there. I will not take that chance again!!! IT DOES NOT PLAY LIKE THE REAL THING!!!!PERIOD
I had one of these once. It was a Chinese SG Standard. I knew it was fake when I got it but thought maybe I could make it into a decent project. Anyway, I think that anybody will be able to tell it’s fake within 2 seconds of picking it up. It does look nice, but all the hardware, wiring, and the wood itself feels extremely cheap. Even after putting better hardware, wiring, and pickups in it I still didn’t like it that much. Now that I have had one in person I can usually tell the fakes online – sometimes something about it just doesn’t look right. Anyway, the bottom line is that the quality of these things isn’t even half of what an Epiphone is.
I believe the pics you show here are from a real Les Paul Supreme. If these companies go as far as bluntly putting the Gibson logo on their guitar, What makes you think they wouldn’t try to fool people by putting pictures of the real thing, and then shipping you their fakes? I recently saw a fake one selling for $1,999 on ebay. I could tell because they had pictures of the actual guitar. It was a rare red, I had never seen on a Supreme, and the logo was way up on the headstock. The pick ups also had more screws than on a real Supreme.
i wrote a comment in march last about upgrading my chinese zak wylde bullet les paul. with the good pups, bridge, tuners and tailpiece and the change of pots and rewire i now have a great looking and great sounding guitar. say what you like but i think i got a good axe for a few hundred quid. i don’t know what the real zw feels or plays like but i know mine is great. I know it’s hard luck for those who chose to buy the real thing but hey these axes are made for people who don’t want to spend thousands of pounds on an instrument. anyway i enjoyed the upgrading process and feel it was well worth it.
Get over your self my friend, the fact that you are willing to purchase a fake means that you are as bad as the people you are complaining about. the fact that they go through a great deal of effort to provide a guitar identical to a real Gibson should be a good thing as you can use it for gigs and bash it around while saving your real Gibson as a special guitar. I feel you should realize that there is no comparison for real gibbous which are over priced anyway and allows a young person to get a great entry level guitar to impress their friends with. also it forces Gibson to raise their low standards as the Chinese get better and better and will soon have a higher standard of craftsmanship than the Gibson guys will so these fake are a good thing and shame on people like you for thinking otherwise
Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Some may consider Gibson to be overpriced instruments, but it is no doubt that they have pioneered and lead the guitar industry, especially the electric guitar and they produce solid equipment. They are deserving of their value.
There are several factors which affect price: 1) manufacturing location (definitely cheaper to make things overseas), 2) materials (quality of materials, woods, hardware, etc.), 3) Supply & Demand, 4) Brand Integrity & quality (this leads back to Demand).
Take all of those into consideration, and you can see why they are more expensive.
If a Chinese company can produce similar quality and craftsmanship as Gibson, then they should make it under their own brand name and state the claim that they are “as good as Gibson, but cheaper.” They shouldn’t try to pass it off as a brand that it is not! If their quality is as good and it stirs competition, then great, Gibson would most likely step it up. There are already guitars such as Ibanez that are made over seas and are a good competition for Gibson. There are many that produce their own “Les Paul” style guitar as well, but it is under their name and has some variations, as they are NOT trying to pass it off as a Les Paul.
This has happened with a lot of goods including skateboard decks. The manufacturing process is cheaper in China, and the quality is NOT as good as USA made decks. And guess what, the consumer does NOT benefit from the savings, as skateboard decks retail prices have NOT gone down since they started doing this. The Chinese craftsmanship is NOT similar in quality yet, plus they have lower manufacturing standards, so they can use unsafe techniques to make products with little or no concern for the employees.
If you are a young person who wants to impress their friends but can’t afford it, doing it with a fake is NOT the right approach in my opinion. Is this how our youth should be raised, to lie about their property? this will lead to a lot more lies. Settle for an Epiphone, Squire or less expensive version of the real thing, but made by the same manufacturer.
If you want to go bash one up stage or music video, then that’s a different story, that is more or less a prop. If you can’t afford to bash a guitar on stage and get a new one, then maybe you shouldn’t be doing that. But if you just need a prop, again, I would suggest getting a cheaper brand like an Epiphone and you could cover up the logo. You could even get a used guitar or Les Paul Studio for pretty cheap and bash that up.
There is also a reason why BMW’s cost more than Hyundai’s, although they both produce automobiles that do practically the same thing, travel, but they do not perform the same.
Do you guys think this one is fake? http://www.musicalwe.com/top-quality-gb-lp-supreme-black-color-recommend-2192152.html
A Gibson Les Paul Supreme for only $250? Not only is the price a warning sign, since these go for well over $3,000 retail, but there are some head characteristics that don’t line up. The Supreme logo looks strange, the banner should be larger on the bottom under the “s” of Supreme. Most Supreme’s I have seen have a truss rod cover that is metallic ( http://www.guitarcenter.com/Gibson-Les-Paul-Supreme-Figured-Electric-Guitar-102165966-i1149452.gc ), not with the word “Gibson” like that one. The headstock appears longer than a real Les Paul too, you can see where the tuner knobs line up. The tuner knob styles are different, they appear round “mushroom-like” rather than the “flower-bloom” style that tapers inward. I haven’t seen a solid black supreme either, but that doesn’t mean they haven’t mad one. Usually they have a burst style or semi-transparent finish.
There are probably some other features that you could compare, but that’s enough to know that this is most likely a fake. I’m not a pro at it, but I have learned some things to look out for.
You can always contact Gibson and have them check the serial# for free and they will provide you info on any of their instruments.
I got this e-mail from the site when I asked them if it was fake or not: Welcome to Musicalwe.com and thanks for your inquiry.
This is Swallow,from Musicalwe Customer Service Center. I am pleased to answer your questions.
The Gibson Les Paul Guitars on our website are made in China, they are not original, but high quality replicas.
We are cooperating with guitar factories directly, so we can get the guitar at fairly reasonable price. Our people are strict with guitar quality control, we will not ship out the guitars to our customers unless we test them without any problem. We have been working with them for over 10 years. If you have any further question, please feel free to contact us.
Your sincerely
Swallow
It is pretty disappointing that FAKES are being produced in China and retailers are supporting them. Also, they are calling them “replicas,” but they’re really straight up fakes, especially when a listing does NOT clearly state it is a replica in hopes that someone will purchase it under the impression it is real. At least they were honest once you contacted them, but seems like an extra step to get clarification.
Even though the retailer may be honest, this does not prohibit the fact that these will eventually make it on the market elsewhere and someone down the road will eventually get taken advantage of. I have seen some fakes going on Craigslist with no mention that they are “replicas.”
Again, if you are buying a Gibson, verify the retailer is an Authorized Gibson dealer, and/or if you are buying used, always contact Gibson to verify the serial number.
If you need a cheap guitar to smash up in a video or stage performance, movie prop or whatever, get one of these fakes, but if you really want a quality inexpensive Les Paul guitar, buy used or at least get an Epiphone.
The imitations would never, ever produce the same Les Paul signature sound.
Even though this is fake, It is probably the most accurate Supreme, let alone Les Paul I’ve ever seen. The giveaway is the Grover Tuners, and probably some shitty hardware. My advice is to change the pickups (buy Gibson BurstBuckers), and It will sound very close to a Supreme. Or sell it for higher
The guitar is ok… The soul plays the guitar,not the brand,And yes gibson is owerpriced as well as some other things in the world that brand sell,s.
I visited that site iemand posted. It says “* Pickups :Epiphone humbucker” under the guitar specifications. I wonder If the epiphone pickups on these guitars are original… Oh, and the SG looks kinda funny. No punn.
i want one where do i get one, what site
I don’t support these fakes, as they are NOT just making a guitar that resembles a real Gibson Les Paul, they are trying to counterfeit them. Especially when they stamp “made in the USA” on the guitar.
I’m sure you can perform a search for these guitars and find some online.
i want one
I don’t mind if people sell these fake Gibson’s as long as they tell the people that are buying them that they are fakes and price them as fakes ($250-$350 range). What really pisses me off is when people pass these pieces of crap off as the real thing and then rip people off to the tune of $2500-$3500. Anybody that does that is a total and complete low-life.
Ess erstmal ein Gürkchen!
this discussion is ridiculous! … I have a “fake gibson” and sounds amazing, looks that kill, and after a long time I could buy for a good price, you in USA think they have artisans who with his magical fairy dust are the only ones able to create a good guitar … surprise, there are artisans all around the world and the recipe is in every guitar that you did before you just copy that (if u can) … to mark it with “Made in USA ” that’s the magic dust you createdt and now you have to believe that “the Chinese are lying, but you lying before telling us that you are the only ones, I am sure that my gibson is not American but you’ll may never say it’s a bad guitar… no matter what! that’s the bottom line.
shame on you when say we are right you are wrong, we are bigs you are smalls your problem is a political one, that’s for the world dont support your point of view
This discussion had nothing to do with politics or any type of discrimination about the quality of products made in other countries other than the United States, nor is it a racial statement for or against industries or products created by any particular race. I happen to be asian myself, where many of the worlds’ products are manufactured and exported from.
Some of the best, top selling products in the world such as iPods and other Apple products are made in China, and we all know that they are arguably high quality.
This discussion is about “counterfeiting,” not the quality of products made by other countries other than the U.S.
If a company produces a product that replicates an existing brand’s product and even goes to the extent of stamping the name of the copied brand on their product, then that is unethical and is misleading to consumers. It is one thing to publicly announce your item is a replica, but carrying over the branding down to the logo on the headstock, is not a good business practice.
It has not been proven that the quality is lower than the true American Gibson brand. Quality is hard to quantify and is mostly subjective. Gibson’s sister brand, Epiphone, makes their products overseas and Epiphone produces Les Paul models and they are great quality as well, but they do not have the Gibson logo stamped on them, nor do they stamp “Made in the U.S.A” on them when they clearly are not.
They sell for less, not necessarily due to lack of quality, but more or less due to production costs overseas vs. in the U.S. That is related to the economic status of a country and is primarily driven by capitalism. I’m not saying it is fair or good, but some countries welcome and cater to the manufacturing needs of many foreign countries that are looking for ways to reduce production costs and it works because they can find ways to produce products for less than what the foreign country can, be it labor costs, infrastructure, or whatever.
If the materials, including the woods, tuners, pick-ups, bridges, frets, electronics, etc. are the same exact ones Gibson USA uses, then the quality difference simply comes down to the craftsmanship. Yes, there are many artisans around the world, including talented and skilled luthiers who can create masterpieces no matter which country they reside in, or race they represent. Nobody is arguing about that.
If you can create a high quality masterpiece product, why try to replicate another existing brand rather than start a new company to represent your own brand, name and quality product?
There are counterfeit guitars and many other products made in the U.S. as well, and the comments posted here are aimed at them or anyone making products that are pretending to be another, no matter where they are made.
I would be just as upset if someone in the U.S. tried to make a fake Rolex and pass it off as a Rolex made in Switzerland. There are fakes Rolex’s everywhere, not sure where they are all made, but I bet they tell time and look great just fine, but that is not the point. People do make fake Rolex’s and although some are sold as replicas, some are sold as being “real.”
This post targeted these Gibsons, because there has been a large growth of these introduced into the market, and although some retailers sell them and publicly communicate they are fake, eventually some will make it into market circulation and be presented as a “real” Gibson. This leads to a high possibility that a consumer will likely get scammed into buying a Les Paul which they thought was a Gibson, at a Gibson price, only to find out it was a less expensive replica.
The only reason why another country was mentioned, was due to the fact that that is where the majority of these copies are being produced. Some countries have softer laws about copyright and counterfeiting, so it is more likely that these will come from countries other than the U.S. And patents filed in the U.S. only apply in the U.S., so if a manufacturer does want to copy a product and try to avoid legal action in America, then they must do it in another country.
So, a fake Gibson made in whatever country by whatever people, could definitely sound & look great, as good or even better than the real thing, which also is somewhat a subjective judgement, but either way, if it is not a Gibson, then simply don’t pass it off as if it was one. Just make a new company and introduce a new quality product to the industry.
I’m sure that other countries can make U.S. currency just as good as we do in the States, some actually do with similar printing plates and techniques, but does that mean they should produce currency and stamp our designs & patterns on them and pass them off as US dollars? It’s all just paper and ink, but there are the aspects of value and ethics that needs to be considered.
I almost bought one of these off ebay in July 2011. Here’s other things to look for. 1. The font on the stamp. The Chinese version do not use as fancy a font as gibson. YOu can look up the gibson font on line and see the differences.
2. The screws on the pickup rings – on gibsons site, you can see there are 4 black screws holding it down and two gold ones for the pickup adjustments. The fakes have 5 gold screws.
3. The fretboard – the gibsons have a black fretboard. The fakes look to be painting a rosewood board black. As the stain wears, you get a reddish area on the board clearly showing the rosewood.
4. The toggle switch. Per gibsons specs, these are cream colored. The fakes have black switches.
5. The binding on the neck. The gibsons have the white binding go up and over onto the side/top of the fret. The chinese ones don’t.
6. The frets – gibson – gold frets, chinese – silver frets
7. The Supreme Logo – Gibson, very crisp and clear, fakes look kind of blurry with no real definition.
8. Turn it over, if there is a place to access the electronics, its fake. The gibsons are solid on the backs
9. The input bracket – (where the chord goes) the gibson ones are rather larger, the chinese are smaller.
10. CHeck the serial number with Gibson. The chinese ones are using what look to be authentic SN’s but when you call gibson, they don’t exist. This is particularly prevalent for 2003. The chinese ones are reproducing 2003 because they were limited and therefore they can ask a higher price.
I hope this helps someone avoid a bad purchase.
Thanks
One other thing…
The fakes are coming with what appear to be gibson cases, have the logo and everything but if you look at the case, in particular the handle, you can see they are junk. Also, they are producing fake certificates of authenticity so beware.
You can buy these guitars from trusted dealers on dhgate,Just check there feedback.These guitars can be had with a nice hardshell case for 350 bucks.The hardware is mediocre but the body is mahogany and the top is maple,I checked it when i did a pickup swap.For the price plus the case you cant beat the deal.They have good tone and sound with stock hardware,There are many guitars going for 10 times this price in the US that dont sound half as good as these with stock hardware,You can buy the guitar for 300 and do 200 or so dollars in upgrades and have a really decent instrument.Most ppl forget that slashs famous les paul was actually a fake LP copy built by lou derrig.These guitars arent true gibson instruments but they have been building guitars overseas for decades,Even making gibson in japan for a few years when the nashville TN plant was flooded.
I don’t disagree with you about the quality that overseas production can be, as we have seen many guitars from overseas are very nice high quality with great sound. However, if you can make a great guitar, no matter where, then just brand it as your own company, don’t try to copy another brand and use their branding on the guitar. If you want an inexpensive version of the “real” thing, then Gibson has the “Studio” series of Les Pauls and SG’s, and the Epiphone brand.
You’re a fucking idiot. Those are both pictures of real LP Supremes. The ones they sell won’t have headstocks quite so similar.
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Thank you for your great feedback Hassan!
Cowardly, faceless, and insulting comments are always welcomed on my blog! I’m all for them, but do your research and understand the content and context in which you post such a childish comment towards.
The images of the fake Les Paul Supreme are the actual photos from the website that sells the said “replicas.” And there are some subtle differences in the headstock details if you look closely.
I always appreciate feedback and criticism especially if it helps educate myself and correct any inaccuracies that I may have presented, but make sure that criticism is backed up with verifiable data and truth, son!
Thank you for your time and visiting my website. Hope you come back soon! 😉
I can see a lot of wierd people and posts here. Counterfeiting is a practice that takes advantage of another entities time, effort and money to produce something without having to invest anything in it. It is a wrong practice and one that should be avoided at all times. Whoever is saying that they make good instruments and that the US is wrong for protesting, is really quite off track. And someone who buys one, with the idea of having the prestige and admiration for being able to buy one of them is deluding themselves and harming the very thing they think so highly of.
If someone can produce a better instrument, let them do it under their own name but without ripping off all of the qualities that the other company has taken so much time and effort to develop. Let’s see maybe we can produce some good heart medicine that looks like the original but doesn’t have any of the ingredients in it that actually costs money. Oh wait a minute, they are already doing that. How about producing a good birth control pill that doesn’t do anything, oh wait someone is already doing that too.
Well let’s see lets try to reproduce something that is harmless and we an just make some money for selling it. Oh hell, why even mess with the producing, since all we want is the money, let’s just go out and rob people.
Does anyone see the goofiness here? When someone is taking your name and putting it on something so they don’t have to do any of the research to get it, is a downright crook and should be avoided at all costs. It isn’t some fun little game. When some country allows it’s citizens to copy other country’s products, they are aiding and abetting criminals. This isn’t some harmless little thing.
When you see a counterfiet, yell, scream point it out, and do whatever you can to make it go away. Don’t buy one of the damned things. It is no different than holding the door open for someone who is robbing a bank. We get what we pay for, if you like counterfiet things, buy one. Otherwise stay away from them.
I agree completely with your statements. Thanks for sharing and visiting my blog.
I have one of these fakes and new pickups. Is there any guide on how to change them, there are no plates on the back of the guitar body.
I received a Gibson Les Paul Supreme, or a reasonable Chinese fascimile thereof, in the mail this past Monday. It’s actually surprising how nice it looks – REAL flamed maple cap. The tuners say “grover” but they suck and are probably fake. The pickups are a bit muddy, but no worse than the stock pickups I had in my 1992 Les Paul Standard that I eventually replaced with Duncans. What else… oh, there are no brass pieces in the REAL abalone “globe” on the headstock. The fretboard markers look nice but are made from “mother of toilet seat” – still, they look pretty good. The back of the neck and body on mine is painted black. Some of the better Supreme copies have the flame on the back, but not mine. It actually plays quite nicely and was set-up pretty decent when I received it. The pickup selector switch is loud when you flip it. The “Gibson” headstock looks authentic unless you look at it real close. The bridge seems cheap. My biggest concern right now is the truss rod – it looks like a hex-socket type, but I tried a 4mm wrench in there and the nut wouldn’t turn. It seemed like the hex wrench was starting to turn inside the socket so I quit to avoid stripping it out. The nut didn’t move and I’m not sure what’s going on there. Fortunately, the neck relief is just about perfect so I don’t really need to adjust it, but it’s still something that concerns me a bit because some day I may need to. All in all, for $280 delivered, it’s a freakin’ good deal!
@ Mike Garcia
Thanks for sharing your experience with this Chinese replica of a Gibson LP. Appreciate you sharing, and again, I’m sure it’s not a bad deal for an electric guitar, but I still have an issue with a company duplicating, copying, counterfeiting, or making a facsimile of any product down to even branding it as the original. To me, that is straight up counterfeiting and the company should consider making a product under another brand.
I’ve been buying these China made guitars for a few years now and I am completely satisfied with them. They cost very little, they ship them to you quickly – longest I’ve had to wait has been 13 days, and the standard of craftsmanship is very high. Yeah there are subtle differences, but I don’t give a hoot. I’ve never had one person look at my collection of 18 “Gibson” Les Paul’s and pick them as a fake. Even if they did I wouldn’t be ashamed because I think that I’m getting a far better deal than the person who buys a genuine US built Gibson. They are overpriced and people simply think they are better because they cost a lot. A very old marketing trick.
I love that there are companies producing fakes and giving Gibson the middle finger. It’s far overdue to happen. No guitar – no matter what model or who made it is worth thousands of dollars. It’s just a hunk of wood and metal made to look nice.
These companies have my support and my dollars. If they keep producing/counterfeiting fine guitars – I’ll keep buying them. Large greedy companies like Gibson deserve to have the rug swept out from under them.
Counterfeiting? big deal…I don’t care if companies want to battle it out in court, I just want my cheap guitars.
I have a couple of Gibsons. I own a Les Paul Studio, and an SG Special (along with a couple of other guitars). They aren’t high end Gibsons, but they are real Gibsons made in the USA none the less.
I bought a fake Chinese goldtop this summer out of morbid curiosity. I figured it would be a good base to upgrade. My luthier skills aren’t the greatest either, so I though one of these would be a good guitar to learn on (rather then messing up one of my better guitars).
After upgrading all the wiring, pots, pickups, switch, bridge, tuners, and nut, the guitar is a player now. It is not as nice or smooth as my real Gibson. But it is pretty good, and looks pretty good too. I have about $500 tied up in this guitar now, and a lot of time. And at the end of the day it is worthless. Even though the guitar plays well now, it is still a fake. It would be tough to sell. No retail stores (at least no reputable retail stores) will touch it because it is a fake (it is illegal to sell these), and Ebay, Kijiji, and Craigslist etc will pull the ad if they think it is a fake (even if you explicitly state it is a fake and don’t try to pass it off as the real thing).
But I don’t think I’ll sell it. I wouldn’t want someone else tring to pass it off as real Gibson further down the road. Maybe i’ll give it away to my nephew who is learning to play guitar when he gets a bit older (and I grow tired of it).
I don’t really have a moral objection to the Chinese \ knock off thing. I bought it knowing full well it was a fake, and it was more to experiment with. In my opinion, you get what you pay for. And anyone who says these play as well as a real Gibson obviously hasn’t played a Real Gibson. There is no comparison, period. The parts and finish are sub par, as well as the finishing products (poly instead of nirto etc…)
But I looked at this whole experience as a learning process. Was it worth the money? Probably not. I only spent $500, but I could have bought a used Les Paul Studio for $600. Any regrets? Not really.
@Sman Thanks for sharing your story. Sounds like an interesting learning experience and exploration. Glad you’re not one to try to pass it off as a real Gibson. I’m still sure it is a “decent” guitar and plays well. Although the quality of the guitar is a big factor, so is the skill of the player. Even a $5000 Les Paul Custom can still sound like crap pending on the player. Keep playing! 😉
You’re incorrect on one point. Not all truss cover plates have three screws to anchor them. Mine is a confirmed fake and has only 2 screw points, top and bottom, just like the real thing. More importantly there isn’t 3 screw holes underneath as would be evident if someone were to have put on a genuine cover.
Thanks for pointing that out. Either way, that is another aspect of a guitar to verify if you have to try to determine a fake.
I fully DISAGREE with you. It’s about time Gibson removed there head out of there ass and realized that an equivilant guitar can be produced for a fraction of the cost of there stuff. Don’t get me wrong I love Gibson and i own a few real ones, but not being a professional guitarist, I cannot justify spending $2500.00 on a guitar that I have always wanted as a kid, but always knowing that I’ll never own one. Furthermore I don’t even know how they can justify theyre prices competitively relative to the USA fender Stratocaster, that have a current value of ~$1200.00 new. Of coarse things such as the custom should stay where they are because they are like DW collectors series, and deserve that price.
@Neil
I appreciate your comment. I don’t think Gibson has ever denied the fact that quality guitars can be made for less than theirs. They already have their price point, overseas-made line, Epiphone which produces high quality guitars for much less than their USA counterpart, Gibson.
A Les Paul likely requires more effort, time and materials than a USA Fender strat. They have carved tops, binding and neck through body construction among several other aspects that are different. Most Les Paul standards start around $1,400, so it’s not much more than a USA Strat. I like Strats too, they’re just a different guitar.
But it’s not just about direct production costs, there are other things other than production efforts and overhead that contribute to the costs of an item. There is heritage, trust, integrity and the overall experience that product provides. It’s the “value” which is not always monetary driven.
What my post is stating is that if you can make a high quality guitar, then that is great and more power to you. It can be done. Just brand it under your own name and make it original. Don’t try to make an exact replica down to copying the name and logo, that is a counterfeit.
I do agree it is pricey to pay for guitars over $1000. It’s hard, especially for children and young people. Again, Epiphone can accommodate this demographic with quality. I think most musicians realize that it’s not the instrument or brand of that makes a good musician, it’s the musician them self. A good guitarist should be able to perform on almost any guitar and make it sound good.
Aside from guitars, there are many products that have a high-end line and a low price point line, even cars. I would not expect to pay the same price for a Hyundai as I would for a Porsche. They make kit cars that mimic high-end cars or classic ones, but they are not trying to pass them off as the very vehicle they are modeled after. They openly state they are kits and no smart person would try to pass one off as authentic.
This is an interesting blog, and ot is not easy to position oneselves in this matter. Personally I agree that some Gibson’s are overpriced and that the company is doing their own share of cheating, i.e. making shortcuts for ‘premium’ products. Some of the stuff that leaves their factories in the US should never pass QC. In that sense, I sort of see the fakes market as a sting to keep Gibson raising the bar in terms of quality, because once their fame becomes ‘just brand’, they will have missed the boat. Its the same as with handbags – LVMH actually makes superior hardware. So they mix brand and quality. If Gucci, on the other hand, tries to sell a funky bag which is manufactured in a sloppy way for 6.000 Usd (no joke), then they should not be surprised of counterfaits enetring the market.
I would never buy a fake Gibson though. Guitars are what I love, and the feeling of owning a dishonest cheat product (stating to be what it isnt) would taint the relationship to this lady.